Author Topic: The pure stock quest for 11's continues  (Read 14768 times)

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Offline 428 CJ hardtops

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The pure stock quest for 11's continues
« on: August 08, 2016, 10:55:31 pm »
After a bunch of issues this spring .Took the car out for a drive and didn't hit second and over revved the engine a bunch well over 7000 rpm .Didn't her any noise so went to the track .Car didn't pull real well and heard some noise coming down the return road .One of the rocker arm bolts had backed off and bent the shaft . Fixed that things seemed ok went to the track and heard some bottom end noise .Took it out and brought the bottom end to Survival performance to get freshened up .Crank barely had a mark on it got lucky there . He decked the block .008 more and straightened up some other issues . Had a hard time with the intake bolting down had it cut .
Got it back together and went to Martin Mich to a race .Bad traction on Friday made for my 12.36 114.06 mph pass as the best one there .Tried a different carb to get a better grip and suddenly was going 12.90 nd lost 9 mph .Next day swapped carbs back and only went 12.80 trans felt funny in 2nd gear  . Went home took the valve covers off to change the intake gaskets and cut the intake a bit more fore a better fit .Had  broker rocker arm on #2 intake valve nd the pushrod and lifter were both laying in the lifter valley .You couldn't hear it still idled at 650 rpm. Got it back together and trans freshened up .Felt real strong going down the road .
I went to the old US 41 drag way on Sunday weather looked good for August air was around 1800 ft .First 2 passes went after it to hard and spun at the 40 to 50 ft mark after leaving ok .Went a 12.36 on the first having to short shift into second early ,second run it wheel hopped bad and just coasted it out .Third went after it softer and left well made a 1rst to third shift and went 12.40 .Fourth went after it softer like before did everything right and went 12.21 .Noticed the engine was a bit cool and mph was down almost 3/4 from the previous pass .150-170 degrees  is what the car likes cooler is slower as is warmer . Next pass made sure the engine temp was as needed left good but less than where it should be 1.85 60 ft went 12.05 at 113.64 . Tried to make a back to back pass because we needed to leave and temp was 190 .went a 12.25 at 112.18 running hot .
 Still lots to do and try need to change oil to my buddy's race oil last year it was 6 hundredths faster just changing oil from what I had .Last year it went a best of 12.01 in cool 45 degree air with a 1.80 60 ft and the good oil so 12.05 with a.05 worse 60 ft far warmer and break in oil is a good start for this year and a fresh trans and freshened engine.
Hope to go to the MNCA race in Norwalk Ohio in a couple weeks ,that track is supposed to stick real well so we will see if the elusive 11's are in the cards . At least its fun again after busting ass for a few weeks and being frustrated .
« Last Edit: August 09, 2016, 02:47:17 pm by 428 CJ hardtops »
had many 428 CJ and SCJ cars over the last 30 years.I currently own a 68 1/2 coupe and a 69 R code SCJ Coupe and a 70 R code SCJ Cougar Eliminator .I am looking for a 70 428 coupe if anybody knows of one for sale.

Offline Brian Conway

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Re: The pure stock quest for 11's continues
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2016, 12:17:38 am »
Thanks for the post.  Sounds like you've been busy.  Those times keep coming down.  I remember a few years ago, I think, your best was 12.43/109.  The 12.05 time is something to be proud of and I' am guessing you'll get into the 11's, knock on wood, pretty soon.  Best wish's for Norwalk.  Brian
65 5R09A 4 spd  GT  Built 5/29/65 
69 9T02R 4 spd  SCJ Built 9/19/68
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Offline Aussiebloke

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Re: The pure stock quest for 11's continues
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2016, 05:13:27 am »
Love reading this stuff!! Good work
1969 Candy apple Red R code

Offline 428 CJ hardtops

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Re: The pure stock quest for 11's continues
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2016, 03:01:42 pm »
Thanks for the well wishes guys. We are going to make a few changes before possibly going to Norwalk .Change the oil to the good race oil ,last fall gained 6 hundredths doing it .Change the front springs from my 69 SCJ coupe to the 68 1/2 for better weight transfer .The 69 car really weight transfers much better and I think its the springs everything else is the same between the 2 cars .Maybe this winter we can get the better heads on it and a new cam for some more horse power for next year. We are using used nascar lifters with a hardened coating on them that Randy recommended and now the cam is wearing instead of cam and lifters .I will get the cam coated also there is a local place to do it .After some upcoming chassis dyno time a gear change may be needed also.
Shifted 6200 on the weekend and it might like a bit more or a bit less .Have a 3.91 gear and 4.30 should it need more or less than the 4.11 in it now .
had many 428 CJ and SCJ cars over the last 30 years.I currently own a 68 1/2 coupe and a 69 R code SCJ Coupe and a 70 R code SCJ Cougar Eliminator .I am looking for a 70 428 coupe if anybody knows of one for sale.

Offline Winnipeg

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Re: The pure stock quest for 11's continues
« Reply #4 on: August 14, 2016, 11:41:05 am »
Hope to see you in Norwalk. After a poor showing at Chicago NMCA I was going to pass on the 1200+ mile trip to Norwalk but, as one friend said and my wife agreed, I would be miserable sitting at home so now planning on going.

Offline 428 CJ hardtops

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Re: The pure stock quest for 11's continues
« Reply #5 on: August 14, 2016, 02:35:02 pm »
Unless things change I should be there and ready to run .Maybe even sneak in a fine tune on the chassis dyno on the way up there .
had many 428 CJ and SCJ cars over the last 30 years.I currently own a 68 1/2 coupe and a 69 R code SCJ Coupe and a 70 R code SCJ Cougar Eliminator .I am looking for a 70 428 coupe if anybody knows of one for sale.

Offline 69cobrajetrugae2

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Re: The pure stock quest for 11's continues
« Reply #6 on: August 30, 2016, 06:00:43 am »
I have not and will never be at your level with respect to 1/4 mile drag racing.  I have studied theoretical engineering fundamentals on drag racing and it is a fine art, that's for sure.

My pal who is turning seventy next year has drag raced mustangs since the beginning and he has a 65 full weight coupe with a 289, single 4 bb and drag tires.   At 2200 feet he does low 11's at around 120 something.  He turned around 302 rods which changed the rod angle and he thinks he picked up 30 HP. 

The only suggestions that I have would be to a run 25 spark plug gap then run a 45 and see how differently she runs.  Running a size smaller jets to bring her into a sweet lean spot might help with a 25 gap.  If the plugs we're filed and twisted slightly to change the flame propagation, that might yield a benefit.

The contacts in the distributor cap might not be exactly at 45 degrees, which can be adjusted with a file as well. The cam angle on the distributor might be slightly off. 

Shortening the resistor wire might provide more HV with the 25 gap.  The 25 gap will give the coil more time to build a charge.

I am likely way off base with my suggestions but I have learned a lot from non car guys.  Their suggestions might be silly,  but they got me to think in a fresh new direction.

Keep at it and one day the magic will pop!

Offline 428 CJ hardtops

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Re: The pure stock quest for 11's continues
« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2016, 02:04:34 pm »
Hope to see you in Norwalk. After a poor showing at Chicago NMCA I was going to pass on the 1200+ mile trip to Norwalk but, as one friend said and my wife agreed, I would be miserable sitting at home so now planning on going.
It was nice to see you there and talk with you ,hope you ran as well as you wanted .We sure were not parked anywhere close to each other .The rain sure messed up things for running on sunday. The air wasn't what I was hoping for and te track wasn't real good for the treaded tires we run .My best pass was a 12.08 at 113.6 with a 1.85 60 ft time . Did get to see a pic with the front end up where it should be with the new springs installed . Will try a few other things before the Pure Stock Drags in a couple weeks . Hopefully 11's are close now with decent air .
had many 428 CJ and SCJ cars over the last 30 years.I currently own a 68 1/2 coupe and a 69 R code SCJ Coupe and a 70 R code SCJ Cougar Eliminator .I am looking for a 70 428 coupe if anybody knows of one for sale.

Offline 161854

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Re: The pure stock quest for 11's continues
« Reply #8 on: August 30, 2016, 02:33:47 pm »
       Look into a rear gear oil change. When I ran Comp eliminator twenty years ago , we played around with some "drag only" stuff and it was worth some et and MPH. I'm sure you know about high front tire pressures and "crowning" ( by shaving) the front tires for less actual contact to the track. Some gear ratios have less parasitic HP losses as well . Those are some of the things you can find on the chassis dyno just like the Nascar guys did, Have you gone to solid bushings for the front eye of the rear leaf springs? How about aluminum bolts to hold on the front fenders? Oops , I'm starting to give out too many secrets.
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Offline crossboss

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Re: The pure stock quest for 11's continues
« Reply #9 on: August 30, 2016, 07:54:45 pm »
Randy,
Giving out 'secrets'?  lol  Aluminum bolts just for the fenders? Hah! How 'bout the rest of the car… lol  Of course, I would have never done that!  hehe...
<My old C.J. heap  aka  S-B Racing!
Current lifelong project: 1969 Mustang Fastback/FOX chassis, Powered by a modern Can-Am 494 (Boss 429), Kaase headed, Autolite 1425 cfm 'B' Inline carb, 6 speed, 4 wheel discs, ala Trans-Am style--Whew!

Offline Winnipeg

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Re: The pure stock quest for 11's continues
« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2016, 11:31:07 pm »
Great visiting and just sorry we did not have more time. My car was inconsistent but running fine and all was good until I red lit in the first round. I guess I should have known it was coming after a .011 and a .004 lights that the next one would be a red bulb.

Still had a great time with all my friends. They came to my rescue when I discovered that one of the trailer hitch bolts (grade 8) had sheered off and with the downward pressure on the hitch the plate that bolts to the frame had a 2 inch crack in it. By the time I left there were new bolts in and the crack was all welded up.

That is the great part about drag racing. The people are always willing to lend a hand no matter what brand your car is.

Also this last couple races are the first time in years that my wife has been able to come along. She retired recently and has now even learned to ride my scooter back and forth just in case I need something in the staging lanes.

Hope you get into the 11's before the end of the season and maybe next year we will get to visit more.

Offline 428 CJ hardtops

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Re: The pure stock quest for 11's continues
« Reply #11 on: August 31, 2016, 03:28:30 pm »
       Look into a rear gear oil change. When I ran Comp eliminator twenty years ago , we played around with some "drag only" stuff and it was worth some et and MPH. I'm sure you know about high front tire pressures and "crowning" ( by shaving) the front tires for less actual contact to the track. Some gear ratios have less parasitic HP losses as well . Those are some of the things you can find on the chassis dyno just like the Nascar guys did, Have you gone to solid bushings for the front eye of the rear leaf springs? How about aluminum bolts to hold on the front fenders? Oops , I'm starting to give out too many secrets.

I am looking into the rear end lube my buddy has some trick engine oil JR1 and gear lube  .I do have the hard front bushings in the springs .I in the past on my Fairlane used a lot of aluminum bolts and lightening tricks .Don't really want to go that far with this car .Might put ceramic bearings in the spindles and rear this winter .
had many 428 CJ and SCJ cars over the last 30 years.I currently own a 68 1/2 coupe and a 69 R code SCJ Coupe and a 70 R code SCJ Cougar Eliminator .I am looking for a 70 428 coupe if anybody knows of one for sale.

Offline redscj

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Re: The pure stock quest for 11's continues
« Reply #12 on: August 31, 2016, 05:39:45 pm »
     Aluminum bolts! That has to be the ultimate pain full way to save a couple of ounces. Did you make them or did you find a source? In this quest to reduce friction, does anybody publish the rolling resistance by bearing part number?
Grant
69 Mach 1 Dearborn SCJ 4.30 4spd 6/17/69 Candy Apple Red
69 Sportsroof Metuchen SCJ 4.30 C6 5/28/69 Acapulco Blue

Offline 428 CJ hardtops

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Re: The pure stock quest for 11's continues
« Reply #13 on: August 31, 2016, 06:55:27 pm »
Fastenal sells them ,got them in various sizes for my old 67 Fairlane had to order them in .We even made bumper bolts from them machine the head rounded and then polish .I don't want to use any of them in the Mustangs.
had many 428 CJ and SCJ cars over the last 30 years.I currently own a 68 1/2 coupe and a 69 R code SCJ Coupe and a 70 R code SCJ Cougar Eliminator .I am looking for a 70 428 coupe if anybody knows of one for sale.

Offline 161854

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Re: The pure stock quest for 11's continues
« Reply #14 on: August 31, 2016, 08:02:55 pm »
   I know what you mean. I was just remembering what some of the F.A.S.T racers did . Like that 9 second '71CJ Mustang, impressive!
68 1/2 CJ FB San Jose white/blue "C" stripe Foulger Ford
 66 GT350 Hertz SFM 6S 477 white/ blue side stripes 1  of 18
3 magazine covers- Car Craft July '77,  Modified Mustangs Feb '11 , and June '14 Mustang Monthly
'78 F350 Oleynik racecar hauler